What are you doing for your bone health?

Cycling Training
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Hi all-

@Petals here. After an eventful last year (not cycling related), I am back to workouts and riding.

I turned 57 last week but at my last Dr appointment, I asked for a bone density scan even though I’m younger than the recommended age.

Backstory- I do a physical job (work at a bike shop lifting bikes and equipment up and down stairs), I lift weights, mountain bike and hike. I played outside and ball sports during my youth through 30’s. I have not had an eating disorder, eat plenty of calcium, don’t drink diet sodas and am in constant motion. I did lose my period in my teens due to all the physical activity (now known as REDS). We didn’t know how harmful that was back then and it was just accepted.

I do have a family history of osteoporosis . My mom and my grandmother both have had osteoporosis, breaking, arms, backs and hips.

Well, my results showed osteoporosis in my hips. Yikes! Even my physician was shocked. Outside of my family history and REDs as a teen, I had no other risk factors. I started Prempro at my last visit and am now being placed on alendronate. I am Rucking in addition to lifting heavy. I work on my balance.

Why am I telling you all this? It’s a reminder that even though we are all active, make sure you are doing weight bearing exercise. Biking does not prevent bone loss. Get your bone density scan if you are in menopause. It is inexpensive and I’m glad I found out now before I lost more bone density. We can do all the right things, but we cannot always outrun our genes.

As we age, falls are our biggest risk factor for losing our independence

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Hahaha @PaleGail i NEVER read the forum before I do a WO. If I don’t do it on Monday I won’t go to the forum until Tuesday or Wednesday.

To add to my challenges in health this week I requested and got a bone death scan. Well I have osteoporosis. I was surprised but not as I lost another inch in height in a year. (I’m 58).

Any info and research on the topic is much appreciated. @Stefanie any tricks for vegans to up their calcium that you know of?

Adding more walking. Thinking of at least 20 min strength/resistance training. Cooked veggies as opposed to raw so I’ll be eating more which will give me more bio available calcium

Not sold on supplements due to recent studies.

@Petals you are also a good resource.

@Coach_Theia I KNOW you’ll find me something. I have a few things to listen to already.

Rebounders? Vibration plates? I’m not going to start running!

I have my century this weekend which might be 75 miles but we will see. Meeting a Zwift friend IRL so that’s exciting too.

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@Gossimrr I also have osteoporosis. Diagnosed last year. I would love for you to share any information you find. Thanks. Maybe we can chat sometime. We can beat this!!

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@Gossimrr sorry to hear about your diagnosis. Here’s a handy PDF of vegan calcium sources I have posted on my fridge. I make sure I eat several of these every day.

vegan calcium
vegan calcium960×960 106 KB

I also take a 500 mg calcium +D supplement daily to make sure I’m not falling short. And I do load bearing stuff like walking, strength training, and lots of gardening.

Have fun on your ride this weekend whether it’s a century or 75!

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@Gossimrr I also have osteoporosis in my spine - diagnosed last year after having osteopenia for a few years. I am taking Algaecal supplement which apparently has studies behind it. Also highly recommend Dr. Keith McCormick’s book, Great Bones – I did a phone consultation with him (after sending him a number of labs) – he was thorough and helpful. Happy to chat about it if you want. I was also in a FB group led by Irma Jennings – a health coach focused on this issue – and she provided a lot of information - including supplementing with food. Heard about Dr. McCormick from her and a lot of the women in that group had gone to him. Did you take hormone replacements? I did not and he thought that was a main reason for the bone density issue - though I’m 10 years out from menopause I a considering a low dose HRT. Don’t have a family history of osteoporosis and my mom was slight build and small

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Thanks for the resources @Kriddley. Regarding HRT, it is not recommended to start HRT if 10 or more years post menopausal due to its potential to cause other health complications. Additionally HRT is a preventative and does not treat osteoporosis. I did not take HRT either and am sure that is why my dexa scores worsened this past year. So…… off I go to gym. :laughing: Sorry for other’s diagnoses but glad to know I’m not alone.

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Hi @bkolden Thank you. Do you have hip or spine osteoporosis? I am aware of some risks but also know the breast cancer one is no longer believed to be accurate. I would consider a low dose (in consultation with my health provider) and it is more to ensure that my osteoporosis doesn’t get worse, not as a preventative measure. It would be useful if you could share the studies you know of regarding the post 10 year advice not to start, and which health complications you are referring to. One other learning on the strength side is from the “liftmor” study in australia which showed an increase in bone density for older women after a lifting protocol that included lifting very heavy (under supervision) with low reps, compared to light weights and high reps. This points to the fact that we do in the gym is important, not just that we lift. Unfortunately no trainers in the US yet certified in the protocol as far as I know. High-Intensity Resistance and Impact Training Improves Bone Mineral Density and Physical Function in Postmenopausal Women With Osteopenia and Osteoporosis: The LIFTMOR Randomized Controlled Trial - PubMed

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I have hip and spine. The spine score worsened this past year. I took alendronate for 5 years then took the recommended 1 year holiday. Due to worsening dexa in that year I started Reclast in June. My mom had osteoporosis so I knew I was at risk plus I have tiny little bones. lol I will have to research about the starting HRT after 10 years since I don’t remember the exact resource outside of a medical conference I was attending. I believe the concern is the risk of cardiovascular complications. I will check and let you know. I have also considered asking a provider for HRT but not sure. You are correct we need to be lifting heavy in the gym. I have recently started a new weight program and a gym in hopes to be able to lift more then I could at home. I have to also juggle lifting heavy with the fact I have arthritis in multiple joints and fake knees so not sure how heavy I will be able to lift but starting slow and steady and see what happens. lol

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@bkolden Thank you. Are you in the health care field? My goal is to avoid having to take meds, so we’ll see. Dr. McCormick looks into bone quality as well (not just bone density) which is impacted by many things, so the tests he ordered help to figure out what supps (or if necessary what meds) are best to resolve the root cause. I’ve been getting back in they gym but probably need a trainer if I’m gonna lift a lot heavier – after I tweaked my back a few years ago doing a deadlift I’m more wary.

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From what I understand - and full disclosure, I have not spent much time reading about osteoporosis as I do with other things - it is a multifactorial event, as explained nicely in this article. So to me, there are several “lines of attack” with nutrition and resistance training being the biggest ones.

One thing I know from reading, listening, and overall educating myself, is that strength training/high impact is paramount to preventing loss, further loss, and protecting fragile bones.

The lifting needs to be heavy for sure, but one needs to get there safely and progressively. @Gossimrr unfortunately Metabolic conditioning exercises (AMRAPs, EMOM, etc), although performed with free weights, are not the best of exercises that help with bones. You need to load the spine, the leg, the hips… Aside from lifting, jumping is also extremely beneficial. Examples are jumping rope, squat/split squat jumps, jumping down from a box, etc. and the jumps need to be on a hard surface. I remember reading that the vibration plate can help also.

@Kriddley a reputable Strength & Conditioning coach/trainer can design an effective program, you don’t need to follow the exact method you mention above, and you’d be better off with someone assisting you with the proper progression and form.

I lift pretty heavy (at least 1.5x my body weight for deadlifts, my body weight for squats, hip thrusts at almost 2x my body weight, for example) and perform high impact/jumps such as the ones mentioned above, plus broad jumps, burpees, etc. 3x/week. As I progressed, I started loading my jumps with dumbbells and a weight vest. It took me 4 years to get here.

Walking is always great, and if you have good core stability and can walk pain-free, adding a weight vest is a good way to get more impact on the bones from walking.

As for frequency and time for sessions… it takes me 5-10 min just to do the warm up, so 20 min is probably too short BUT something is better than nothing.

I started with 2x/week and am now doing it 3x/week and each session is 75-90 min. I make strength a priority and do everything I can to not miss a session. I also walk 45 min/day. I know this can be hard for someone who does not have a flexible schedule like I do. But I firmly believe in making strength a priority, even if that means cycling less.

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yes @Kriddley i am a family nurse practitioner (also certified in psychiatry) and my practices have always been “mainstream” medicine so that is my bias. I have seen two dear friends recently suffering osteoporotic pathological fractures and am motivated to avoid that. Medication made sense to my mainline medicine brain and I trust my osteoporosis provider. I started the alendronate as part of a research study now 6 years ago. My provider recommended reclast for 3 years.

I doubt I will be able to do the crazy lifting @Coach_Theia is doing but I have certainly upped my game at the gym with this new program in the 3 weeks I have been doing the sessions twice a week. I hope to increase to three times a week if/when I really retire. (yeah I already failed retirement once. lol) The session takes at least an hour and usually more. I only walk twice a week due to schedule and the fact that walking seems to make my fake knees sore later and especially the next day.

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@bkolden you are making impressive progress in the weight room!! Very excited for you.

I believe I am a “jumper” and can do that now because I spent 12 years jumping on hard surfaces “barefoot” (i.e., with ballet shoes which have zero shock absorption) and another 2 decades jumping in Step and aerobic classes :rofl:

Wanted to add that creatine has shown some promising results for bone health:

https://typeset.io/search?q=does%20creatine%20help%20with%20bone%20density?

@bkolden @Gossimrr did you have osteopenia and if so, when was that diagnosed?

My mom is 92 and doesn’t have osteoporosis, and has never done sports or weight lifting. But she did grow up in a farm with all-around natural foods and ran tons, rode horses etc, so who knows. She does have big, thick bones.

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@Coach_Theia No jumping for me either… knees are not interested! I was thinking of the weight vest but if not careful, especially on an already less dense spine, one could get compression fractures. I need to read more on this. I hear there are some studies on vibration plates but don’t know the details. I am taking creatine… I used to love step aerobics! Apparently that jumping didn’t stick – i still really think it is the hormones… and the precipitous drop in estrogen. Did your Mom take HRT Coach Theia? My mom (who passed away last year at 93) did not have osteoporosis – or so she said. – Did shrink in size though which can be attributed to spine compression from age I guess? And she was pretty small at 4’11. And didn’t take HRT as far as I know, so… all bodies are different I guess :woman_shrugging:

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I was diagnosed with osteopenia at age 59 (4 years after menopause) when I was screened for inclusion in a university research study on the benefit of exercise (gym work) on bone health. I was randomized into the alendronate group and after the 2 years of the study I continued it for 3 more years. It is unknown how long I had osteopenia because that was my first dexascan. Diagnosed with osteoporosis 1 year ago. I personally don’t believe every female is doomed for osteoporosis. I believe genetics play a part and possibly bone type. I have always had tiny small bones despite being tall at 68inches in my youth. I was a runner for probably 20 years until had to cross train due to unbearable knee pain at age 40. I crosstrained to cycling and really didn’t realize it was not bone promoting. As I said my mom had osteoporosis so I wasn’t surprised but thought the cycling was more protective than it was for me. This past year i have been cycling harder, walking more and doing light weights (50 lb squats, etc) and surprised my scores worsened.

@Kriddley my orthopedic surgeon said I should never jump on my new fake knees. But I decided to give box jumps a try this week. (It is part of my new strength program) To my surprise my knees didn’t hurt and no residual pain later. So I am going to keep them in my program. I started with the first few jumps onto a weight plate on the floor. Once I had the body movement sorted I tried a 6 inch step and amazingly enough I could do it without pain and without tripping or falling. Must admit I stood there for awhile staring at that step gathering courage and then just did it. Next week I will try something higher. For me, I think jumping up is not as much impact on the knees as would be jumping down, which so far is not part of the program.

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Thanks @Coach_Theia. As you know you are a big part of that progress. Thank you

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I don’t think so. It’s amazing she has such great memory but for certain things… All she remembers is taking “something” her doctor gave her for some menopausal symptoms, but she says the symptoms were never overwhelming. That was circa 1980 and I have no idea if doctors prescribed hormones then. My mom did have bone scans a few months ago, and as a result her doctor sent her to lift some weights to build muscle on top of the strong bones. She says some of her sisters had osteoporosis, so like you said, bodies are different.

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It’s very useful to read and learn about each of your experiences with osteoporosis… I haven’t had a DEXA scan and my doctor said I don’t need it yet. I’m 47, at what age is recommended to have that scan? Dr. Google told me 65 :woman_shrugging:

Also, lifting heavy is a very relative term… My heavy lifting is not even a warm up lift for @Coach_Theia but I think that the term just means less reps with whatever weight is heavy for each person instead of for example doing 50 goblet squats with a 10 pound dumbbell. However if someone can only do 4-8 reps with a 10# DB maintaining good form then that is a heavy squat and that’s where you start.

@bkolden so great to hear you tried the jumps!! The height is not important… I also started doing my jumps on a small step and little by little increased the height. The jump box I use now is for kids… 16”, 18” and 20” and it also took some courage to try my first jumps onto the box…

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You are absolutely right! My “heavy” would be a warm up for you! (@Coach_Theia is in an entirely different world. :laughing:) But I am working to lift heavier than I did last week or last month depending. I found I can squat a little heavier with the barbell in gym than I can with dumbbells at home because my arthritic hands just couldn’t hold anything heavier. And my upper extremity arthritis limits how heavy I can do some moves but I try to lift a little heavier than before.

Thanks for your encouragement about the box jumps. I felt kinda silly staring at the step and wondering how to do this. How could I not know how to jump? lol Any kid can jump!

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You’d be surprised, not all can. It’s really interesting.

I am glad I started this conversation. I’m
Learning a lot. I am traveling today but will respond soon.

:two_hearts::two_hearts:. This is one of my favorite groups.

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Hi @Covi Don’t listen to Dr. Google – I’m 60 and got my first one about 6 years ago at which point I was already in osteopenia - and actually had I been advised well at that time I might have done HRT. If your insurance covers it, I would say push to get it as soon as you can but at least by 50 – my two cents. Information is power. Our health system does not do prevention well. Seeing the trajectory you can nip it in the bud… I suppose considering if you have it in your family is important. Also any metabolic syndrome or gut health issues can contribute to it. I would definitely suggest following Dr. McCormick and looking at his book. He also recommends getting your Dexa at the same place each time for better comparisons, so think about that when you choose. Machines are different. Finally on DEXA - if you can get one that also provides Trabecular Bone Score (TBS) which looks at bone quality (often this is not available) it is very helpful information. Detailed explanation is in Dr. McCormicks book Great Bones

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